Transcription

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In this episode we speak to Melanie Gnau - a small living expert. Melanie teaches about creating a sustainable and beautiful home through DIY, shopping second hand, gardening and living mindfully. Her blog A Small Life and social media sharing highlight how to make small, but life altering changes to how we live - that can benefit us as individuals, but also the planet as a whole. We also talk about her Isleta Pueblo heritage, how neurodiversity can be a consideration of functional design and even how cleaning can create compelling content. We talk about the different aspects of minimalism - beyond the asthetic.
Melanis also shares how she balances the different aspects of her business and how the personal and political aspects of sustainability can intertwine, creating a meaningful life that benefits ourselves, our community and our planet.

We recorded this conversation before the devastating floods in Australia and the invasion of Ukraine. Seeing horrific events like these and knowing that there are other global events receiving less media attention really shines a light on what a privilege it is to have a safe, comfortable home - even though it is a human right, it is not something we can take for granted.
We hope that this conversation can both help us all create a functional and nurturing environment within your own home, and enhance our capacity to help others - maybe through volunteering, contributing to grassroots fundraising, political lobbying or making ethical purchasing choices. One of the huge benefits of ‘living small’ is that it can free up energetic and financial resources that enable us to have a bigger positive impact.

flowartists
All right? Melanie. Thank you so much for speaking with us today. It's so great to get the chance to speak with you. Perhaps you could just start by telling us a little bit about your background and where you grew up.

Melanie
Sure, thank you for having me my name is Melanie Gnau and I am a small space expert and coach and that means that I teach and write about small spaces. I grew up in a relatively small town in central North Carolina in the US. .

flowartists
And so would you like to expand and tell us a bit about all of the different things that you do because I know it's quite a lot.

Melanie
Sure I work for myself. So that means that I wear a lot of different hats. I do my coaching and writing of course. I do some social media freelance and I also sell vintage and I know that's not what a lot of business coaches would probably tell me to do. They tell me to focus on one thing but I'm pretty risk adverse and I feel better knowing that I have several different income streams and it works for me. I like being busy and having a bunch of different things to do.

flowartists
I agree, I teach yoga and I feel like having lots of different jobs means that if somethings hit a bit of a brick wall. It's not like you've lost your job. You've just lost one of your jobs and it just kind of keeps things interesting when you've got lots of different things going on.

Melanie
Right. It definitely does.

flowartists
And I really appreciate when you share on your Instagram which is how I know you um, particularly when you share about your Isletta Pueblo culture and hopefully I've pronounced that correctly, please correct me if I haven't and how it really informs your environmental activism and your sustainable lifestyle and. It seems like a sense of responsibility and stewardship rather than just a sense of ownership of land is true for a lot of First Nations cultures, would you like to share a bit about this?

Melanie
Sure. So first off I want to say that I obviously don't speak for all Native peoples. It can be kind of a common misconception that we all believe in the same thing. Ah but in my experience I was taught that the earth doesn't belong to us. That we are part of the earth and that it's our job to take care of it. Um, Indigenous people statistically are the world's largest land conservators and they just often don't get credit for that.

flowartists
And so do you see it like maybe philosophies that you've grown up with in contrast with the consumerist kind of culture of a lot of life online because a lot of that is how people make their money by selling things. Versus that focus on conservation and sustainability because that gets shared as well. So It's an interesting kind of interplay.

Melanie
Yeah, um I Definitely think that it's I give and take. But ultimately we want to leave the world better than what it was when we came into it.

flowartists
Absolutely and I think um, that is one of the things that I find really inspiring about what you share and about a lot of what other people share how sustainability can be little everyday actions. Like it can be just taking care of the things that you own or shopping secondhand and it's really interesting seeing that being shared versus just make it look pretty.

Melanie
Right? Yeah and I mean I think that those two things can exist together. I think that that's kind of what we see a lot of times with, I know it's American culture. Everything is black and white right. Ah, people are very uncomfortable with there being anything in between or having a bunch of nuance. But I think that with at least my culture I've seen that and I've learned that you know things are complicated and it's okay. To go in 15 different directions and learn more, like if you listen to a lot of Pueblo folktales, They go all over the place. You know like they're not this linear story that we think of when we think about like a movie or a Tv show. They definitely go off in all these different directions and I think in some ways that's maybe more reflective of the way that the world actually is.

flowartists
Yeah, it doesn't all get tied up into like a neat little happy ending at the end of the story.

Melanie
Right? right.

flowartists
Pueblo style architecture is always also really distinctive and really beautiful. Would you like to share a little bit about that for people who haven't seen it?

Melanie
Yeah, it is um I don't know how much you'll see of this but when you think of like the Southwest, being an American when you think about what the southwest looks like it's really what the southwest looks like Adobe architecture. Is what the Pueblo people invented and it's pre-span contact. They actually used this technique called puddled Adobe and it's where mud is laid in horizontal layers and it builds up these walls. And then they also incorporate stone and sod blocks into those I'm trying to think what would be similar to something that maybe you'll have like an earth ship. It's kind of similar to like an earth house. Have you seen those?

Melanie
It's very similar to that sort of construction and the doors and the windows were often actually on the roof of the home so you'd have to climb a ladder to get inside and my Grandma would tell us that when it was hot outside. They'd often like sleep on the roof that was sort of like a little additional space for them and Pueblo people are also famous for their bread and that is made in Adobe Ovens so like this mud. These mud layers get really really hot and will cook the bread without any sort of um, additional heat. So that's really interesting too. Yeah.

flowartists
Oh just from the sun. Yeah, and they're multi-story buildings as well, right? and sometimes even built into caves in Cliff faces.

Melanie
Yeah, some of them ah depending on which tribe, like the Taos tribe. Um, they have some of the oldest architecture in the United States and they were multi-level homes and actually some people think that they were the first apartment buildings. So like they were built kind of on top of each other and some people think of those as the first apartments.

flowartists
Wow So cool and so in tune with the environment because it's like a desert environment that would get really hot and really cold. So like these snug little Multi-story dwellings would just be perfect to withstand those environmental extremes.

Melanie
Right? So they used what was obviously around them which was you know a lot of mud and stone and sod and um during the day it would heat up in there and then as it cooled down because it was a desert at night. It would get really cold. When you would go in your home, it would be warm at the end of the day.

flowartists
Oh so nice and so just flowing on from there I know that minimalism is something that you really write about and share about a lot and I first encountered minimalism through art. So it was really more of an aesthetic but you share about different types of minimalism.

flowartists
Would you like to kind of go into some of the other aspects of it?

Melanie
Sure that so there's 6 different types of minimalism. There's aesthetic which is probably what you and most people think of sort of that look. There's essential which is quality over quantity. There's experiential where people that really put travel first. Sustainable like we've mentioned a little bit financial and then also mindful minimalism which is kind of more of a spiritual way to think of things.

flowartists
And so this might be a stupid question but can you be a minimalist and appreciate the spiritual aspects of life if you really like stuff or is that the first stage of just letting go of that?

Melanie
Ah I think so but I think that you really want to think about your why like I mentioned with the 6 different types. You really want to think about which one of those are you if you're an essential. You're probably not, ah, going to want a lot of stuff you're going to want quality over quantity. But if maybe you're a sustainable minimalist... Ah you know sometimes keeping things is a little bit more sustainable than throwing them away. So ah, maybe you would have more stuff in that sort of genre.

flowartists
I Actually struggle with that myself a little bit because if you like making things and you like upcycling and reusing things often. There's quite a collection of like bits of wood and bits of fabric and things that...

10:11.45
flowartists
Aren't useful right now that feel like they've got a lot of potential for the future.

Melanie
Right? right? I can be like that. But my husband who is an artist is very like that, he sees like a potential in everything you know.

flowartists
Ah.

flowartists
I um did a Marie Kondo cleanout and I made myself another category which is like Sparks joy and then potential future joy.

Melanie
Ah I think she would support that.

flowartists
Yeah, because you know as soon as you get rid of that like bit of plywood you going to need it for your next project.

Melanie
Sometimes I mean with wood especially, like it is so expensive here now, that like some things you really do feel kind of guilty getting rid of or giving away.

flowartists
And actually that's something that I've noticed you share about which I've learned from you. One aspect of pairing down and decluttering is really thinking about what happens to the stuff that you're getting rid of and how often just donating it to an op shop or a thrift shop isn't actually the most sustainable option because you're kind of making it someone else's problem to deal with from there. What are some of the other ways to clear out and get rid of the things that we don't want anymore so they actually do find useful new homes?

Melanie
Right? right.

Melanie
Yeah, so first of all I would really suggest that people. Um I read an article one time that said, if you wouldn't give it to your judgey mother-in-law then don't give it to a thrift store. So make sure stuff is in really good condition. Ah, before you donate because it's more likely to not go into the trash or you know, get donated overseas or something like that and this really does vary from location to location. So you might want to do some googling or calling around in your area to see where you can donate. Um, if you have a buy nothing group I don't know if y'all are familiar with that or you have that where you live but um. Mine is actually on Facebook and you can go on there and say to people in your local area like I have this does anybody want it?
Um, also maybe like women's shelters. I often donate my things there because there's one that sets people up with things that they need for their home when they're fleeing domestic violence and then also thinking sort of out of the box with your stuff as well.
Like recently I had towels that I needed to give away so I called an animal shelter to see if they could use towels. Ah, because you know they're always giving dogs baths and they need things to cuddle in. So um, yeah, just thinking about the ways that your stuff can have a new life in maybe a little more unconventional way than just giving it to the thrift store.

flowartists
We also have online Good Karma groups, where you can also post for the things that you're looking for and they have them for different suburbs and then there's also Darebin hard Rubbish Heroes which is more giving away things that are a bit more random. You definitely couldn't take it to the op shop. But um, something...

Melanie
Yeah.

flowartists
I've noticed just come up in the politics of some of the online rehome My stuff groups is people can get really fixated on. Why is this person getting rid of all this stuff? It's just outside on the street outside their house and kind of forget that.

flowartists
Different people have different lives and if you don't have a car or if you are disabled and you can't carry a big load of stuff to dispose of it somewhere else, like sometimes ah this came up in the context of the hard rubbish day which is the one.

melanie
Yeah.

flowartists
Time of the year where you're meant to put that stuff out and so it can be dealt with with the council. And yeah I think it's an interesting interplay between yes sustainability but also community and kind of understanding that not everyone has that same ability to.

Melanie
Do here.

flowartists
Manage their lives in the same way that you might be able to.

Melanie
Right? right? I Definitely think that's an important aspect of it as well. I know with like my buy nothing group a lot of times I'll say just like um so I don't have to deal with sort of the stress of you know, figuring out when somebody can come by or you know. All these different aspects I'll just say I'm going to put it on my porch and you can come pick it up here's you know the address.

flowartists
Yeah, definitely because if you are like a woman living on your own or an older person. You might not want to invite a stranger from the internet into your house to pick up your fridge.

Melanie
Yeah, yeah, definitely.

flowartists
And so I know that you do like small space design and coaching where people kind of get you to help them with aspects of their home. Are there some common themes that you just see playing out in a lot of different people's homes.

Melanie
Yeah, so a lot of people design for either the person that they want to be or the person that they think that they should be so I often see people saying well this is for when I entertain...

Melanie
And then I ask them how much they entertain or how often they entertain and they do it maybe twice a year. So to me that's really when I would look at and question. Why are we keeping our homes a certain way?
When we're only doing something once or twice a year like they say 'oh well, I need to keep say, my dining room table for when...' and they have this giant dining room and they say 'I need to keep this for when we have thanksgiving'. And maybe they only do thanksgiving you know once a year so that's when I would really think about okay, can we repurpose that into something that maybe you can transition into a dining room once a year?
Or can you even maybe, Ah, start a new tradition where you go ah rent. You know an airbnb or something and you cook your feast there would that be more comfortable and um, fit your lifestyle better.

flowartists
Especially like over the last two years it's like who's having big gatherings at all?
That dining table would have got no action.

Melanie
Right? Yeah, that's something that I've seen a lot in the past two years is um, people don't need to entertain as much as well as people really need those office spaces.

flowartists
And so do you have some usual first steps that you go with people to help make their homes a more enjoyable and more productive place to live?

Melanie
Yeah I think that I would ask them really what their pain points are so this is going to vary from home to home but fixing your pain points will make your house a much easier place to live.
So I would have them really take me through their day and see what is kind of annoying to them and what makes their house sort of uncomfortable.
Like a lot of times I'll see that when people first walk into the door. They're already uncomfortable because maybe they have a jumble of shoes at the door and maybe they even bought you know, this big um storage set to put their shoes and everything but the shoes are not getting put in there so we want to figure out what is an easy solution for them to put these shoes away so they're not stumbling over them every time they walk in the door.
And that might be as easy as instead of having like a big storage solution just throwing them in a box and really that um one fix can make your home so much more comfortable and enjoyable. And I think people don't often realize that until they actually fix it. You know what I mean?

flowartists
Definitely I Think there's a good aspect of being honest with yourself as well, and it's like how diligent am I going to be?
Like can I have a cupboard with the door or do I need a basket that I can just put this into?

Melanie
Um, yes, yes, exactly and people really want to kind of hold themselves to a higher standard. But I think it's totally fine I have a basket by the door. You know I have baskets almost all over the house where if somebody is coming over or I need to make it look a little bit nicer I can just throw stuff for the time being it doesn't have to be that way always but these little solutions make your home a lot more comfortable to live.

flowartists
I'm seeing more and more as well people sharing online from a neurodiversity perspective and the little house Hacks that people are doing to make their homes just function better for them as an individual versus the perception of what a home should look like so one thing I've noticed is that sometimes people.

flowartists
Leave things on the bench in a very visible spot like all the things you need to do to do that task because if it's put away. It's out of sight out of mind and so even though cluttered surfaces might not be something we see in magazines if it means that you're going to.

flowartists
Do that thing that you need to do every day then that's just so much more functional.

Melanie
Right? And I mean I do think if you really prioritize your aesthetics. There's a pretty way to do that too. You know like I forget to take my vitamins but the vitamin container is so ugly so instead I just take a jar...

21:19.80
Melanie
A normal, you know, like an upcycled jar that I've taken the label off and I put my vitamins in that and then I keep them right by where I've made my coffee so I remember it every day. So I think there are these little solutions that if you want to have a beautiful home but you're also. Ah, neurodiverse like I am um, you can still make that happen.

flowartists
Because there's definitely the flip side I think for everyone but especially, you know if you're more sensitive to your environment if there's too much stuff everywhere. It just makes the whole of life harder to cope with.

Melanie
When yeah, yeah, there is that too.

flowartists
And so um, we might have already covered this but are there any like really easy things that we could probably do all of us right now to make our homes more enjoyable and more productive like the low-hanging fruit that is just. 1 small thing you can change and instantly feel that bit better about your space?

I Think a lot of times it is the decluttering and people really think with decluttering you have to ah put aside like a whole weekend to do things but I never have time for that. So What I do is instead I Just keep a bag by the door and like maybe I open up a cabinet that I don't usually open and I see that there's something in it that I don't often use and I haven't used in a while I'll just place it in the bag. So then. I know that I have a little pile going of that stuff that is just being sort of constantly decluttered and constantly um, looked at and evaluated.

flowartists
I think that's good as well if you're someone who has trouble letting go of things, like I do this with clothes where if it doesn't fit or I'm not wearing it I'll put it in my giveaway box and it kind of waits there until the next clothes swap with my friends and then.

flowartists
Have another look at the box on that day and that will be my final edit and if I can't let it go yet I'll find another spot for it. But if it's already been in the bag or in the box and out of circulation for a while and I haven't missed it then you're already like oh yeah I haven't missed that thing. It can go and find a new home now.

Melanie
Yeah, right, it sort of makes it easier to distinguish what you are using as well if you sort of take it out of the rotation.

flowartists
And I guess that's the bonus of decluttering because once you've edited out the things that you're not using you see the things that you are using and you use more of them.

Melanie
Exactly yeah.

flowartists
I'm just curious, we sort of mentioned a little bit earlier about Covid, maybe affecting, how people might not be meeting us with each other or having gatherings as much. I was just wondering if you've noticed whether, Covid's affected other ways people might live in a small space sense?

Melanie
Yeah, I think the home office thing, most people, at least for a while they were working from home if they could. So I've seen a lot of people trying to fit a home office into you know, a closet or their guest bedroom or a garage, I've seen a lot of that. I've seen like we said people entertaining a lot less and I think I've also just seen a lot more evaluation of what people's needs are and at least for me, I have really ah prioritized function over fashion. So like I no longer feel comfortable going to the gym so I had to actually got a treadmill off of my buy nothing group. Ah, for free and I put it in my home office/guestroom. So now it's a gym/guestroom/home office and you know it's not the best looking thing in my house and it's probably not something that I would really take pictures of but...

flowartists
Ah.

Melanie
It's functional and it works for me and I think that's really what a lot of people have learned over the past two years

flowartists
Just to cycle back to the office in the cupboard I've seen it online so much and it looks really cute and a lot of times people do wallpaper and they make it look really pretty. But do you think anyone actually uses them? Because I need all my cupboards, they're all maximum full and I feel like...

flowartists
Being in a little box staring at a wall would make work feel very uninspiring. Like, I think it was me I'd put my laptop in there sometimes but then tend to work around the house. Anyway, I mean we don't have kids. So maybe that's a factor.

Melanie
Yeah I I think it depends on who you are I think that's another one of those things where you kind of have to know yourself I am actually shoved in a tiny closet right now because this is the only space I have for recording where it's.

flowartists
Oh it's great for audio. Yeah.

Melanie
Um, mostly quiet. Yeah, but um I think that's again, just sort of like knowing yourself and I yeah I definitely have other stuff in here as well that doesn't have to do with the office. So I think, if you have additional storage outside of your office then that might be good and for some people too, being able to sort of shut that away at the end of the day is really essential.

flowartists
Yeah I get that. Yeah, it is interesting. This you know, working from home. I work with some other people in my day job where yeah, you'll see kids wandering around behind them putting away the dishes and yeah it sort of makes for an interesting situation doesn't it.

Melanie
Okay. Yeah.

flowartists
I Mean it's good. They're training the kids to put the dishes away entirely.
Yeah say another thing that I see a lot of online as a bit of a fantasy is the like #VanLife fantasy and often like...

Melanie
Ah, yeah.

flowartists
It's Airstreams and they fit it out in a really beautiful way and I know that you fitted out your airstream in a really beautiful way and lived in there for 4 years do you want to share a bit about how the reality of that might be a bit different from what we see on Instagram and just about your experiences doing that?

Melanie
Sure, just so people um, kind of have a way to conceptualize it. The airstream was about one hundred and eighty Eight Square feet and I think that um maybe when people see it. They don't realize what, that actually looks like but it's it's pretty small and I actually really enjoyed it. Um, we were able to save a lot of money which was the goal and I really never felt crowded. But I did at that time work outside of the home. So I think that did help, but I would definitely do it again.

flowartists
And how did like one thing I always wonder about because you had your toilet inside... and I guess if like if you're not in the Instagram Van life following, like, an airstream's just like a caravan but a cool looking one. Um, how did you go with your toilet being so close to where you made your food, like, was it something that bothered you?

flowartists
Or was it like well sealed and well ventilated enough that it wasn't really an issue?

Melanie
Well at least the way our airstream was set up the bathroom was in the back like it was the farthest away pretty much from the kitchen that you could get. I do think that the worst part was probably the bathroom situation. Um, so the bathroom was very small. And I actually still sort of have the one bathroom problem today and I think if I had to change anything about my home I would probably add a half bath just ah so I could get ready while my husband is in the bathroom.

flowartists
And so were there any surprises about your airstream life?

Melanie
I think that I was probably most surprised about how much I liked it. We came from a I think it was about twelve hundred Square feet loft apartment that was very nice and looked very beautiful. Ah, but had all kinds of problems and I think that I really enjoyed being able to make a space my own even if it was very small and I really enjoyed having less stuff and not having to worry about you know cleaning a giant apartment every weekend or you know sort of when you have space sometimes you feel like you need to fill it. And when I didn't have the space I realized how much stuff that I didn't actually use.

flowartists
And I guess since one of your jobs is selling vintage. You also had a good outlet where you could move on all of the things that you didn't need and then have more in your renovation fund to make the improvements that you would want to make while you're living in your air stream over time.

Melanie
Yeah, um, actually that is how we got started in selling vintage is that when we downsized to the airstream we wanted or needed to get rid of some things and they were nice things and we didn't want to just give them away or throw them away so that is how we got into selling that sort of thing as well.

flowartists
And I know you were working in a like as a librarian at the time, I think. I've read your blog and I feel like books would be one of those things, that it's such a sentimental thing, like books that you've loved and really, that's..

flowartists
Something you might not look at for a couple of years. So probably wouldn't have a home in a very small space. Did being a librarian make it easier because you had all the work books or make it harder because you're a lover of books?

Melanie
Okay, yeah.

Melanie
I think that it made it easier because when you're a Librarian Um, you realize that you can get almost any book that you want at the library and it usually doesn't take very long to get. Um. So. It's kind of like your collection just lives there. Um, Also we have to always go through a process every few years of what they call deselection where you would run a report and see which books hadn't been checked out for a long time and then those books would either be sold or given away and I think that it makes you less sentimental about books than a lot of people are.

flowartists
That makes sense and I just have one more #vanlife question. Um, a lot of the accounts, well a lot of media that we see about small space living and about living in an rv or an airstream is kind of the affluent white hipsters to doing it.

Melanie
Sure.

flowartists
And making it seem kind of glamorous, but a lot of people have been living in small spaces forever by necessity and I think it is one of the cool things about social media because we do get to see more diverse people's lives and people who we don't necessarily see on a tiny home show on tv.

flowartists
Would you like to speak a little bit about that aspect of online community and if you have noticed as well? A bit of a difference between the small space living media that you see and the small space living reality that you might see.

Melanie
Yeah I think we do see a lot of the aesthetic side of it which can reel people in but it can also be discouraging for people because a lot of times that sort of style is really difficult to replicate. Um, but I am encouraged by other folks who share their homes on Instagram and things that I see online I really like following people whose home is small but it doesn't necessarily fit that sort of white space aesthetic Shavonda Gardner.

flowartists
I follow her too. She's great.

Melanie
Is someone, she's somebody that I really think of for that. She lives in California where the houses are oftentimes smaller. Um, and her space is small but it's still colorful and beautiful and that's what I'm really inspired by.

flowartists
And I really love as well that she really highlights Black artists and honoring different cultures in the design items that she chooses in her home and shares about that on her account as well. So.

Melanie
And here.

flowartists
Like as well as sharing the beauty of an object. She'll share a bit about the history and the culture of it as well and how living with that enriches her daily experience.

Melanie
Yeah, and I think when you live in a small space. It's important to have things that do have that meaning because you want something that is maybe not just aesthetically beautiful but has a meaning behind it, because you can only have so many things right?

flowartists
Yeah, like you might not be able to have something that's just purely decorative. But if it's decorative and has a function then it definitely has a home.

Melanie
Um, yeah.

flowartists
And I also really appreciate this aspect of social media seeing like women and non-binary people create their spaces online when often like building and carpentry can still be quite a Macho space and quite a...

flowartists
It could be intimidating kind of go into the hardware store sometimes where you might be talked down to by the person who you're asking the questions of, or it can just be intimidating to be like, 'where do I start with this project?' and you can get the impression that people don't think that you're capable.

Melanie
Um, a.

flowartists
And seeing people build things with their own hands and figure things out and people outside of that traditional macho kind of stereotype is really empowering and really inspiring would you like to share a little bit about that aspect of the online build your home experience.

Melanie
Sure I really appreciate the women and non-binary people that do that because um, you'll often receive a lot of pushback and criticism and I think that's very hard as a beginner. Like when you're first learning something and somebody tells you that you're doing it wrong. That's kind of it's hard. It's really hard to bounce back from that. Ah, but I do think that it's important to share that as well because you're seeing other people like you and. They're saying well I tried this and here's how I did it. It might not be how you would do it but I want to encourage you to try it too and that you shouldn't be scared to try this.

flowartists
Yeah, because sometimes when you're getting into like building things in your home. It can be expensive like the materials can be expensive and it can also be quite hard work. So if it starts to go wrong halfway through...

flowartists
It can be very disheartening and it can be super helpful if you can like look up and be like oh yeah, they did it that way and actually um Youtube is super helpful in that area. I've looked up heaps of tools that I have that I didn't really... like I had to change the blade in my jigsaw the other day so I'm like..'I'm going to go to Youtube and see how I do this.'

Melanie
Um, yeah.

Melanie
yeah yeah I don't know if y'all are on Tiktok but I see a lot of that on there as well. Like um, there's this person called the 'Trans Handy Ma'am' and...

Melanie
They teach people how to do really basic things around the house and it just blew my mind, like, how helpful and generous that that is like showing them how to change a light bulb you know and it's things that you would think oh well, that's easy. Everybody would know how to do that. But they really...

Melanie
Don't and I thought that that was really a ah, beautiful and helpful thing.

flowartists
Absolutely And how much of an impact does that have on your daily life when, like I've had this when we've got like a light bulb that's up really high and I haven't had a high enough ladder. So to always be in that dark room for ages till you can manage to sort out what you need to do to change that light bulb and then you're so appreciative of it.

Melanie
Yeah.

Melanie
Right? Or you have a bad, a bad landlord who um, you know you asked them to change it forever ago and they just never did and here's how you can empower yourself and learn how to do it yourself. You shouldn't have to but you know.

Melanie
Sometimes that happens.

flowartists
And I also find another bonus of watching those how to videos and also the cleaning videos is it makes you go and do something after you've watched the video even if it's just reorganizing a drawer.

Melanie
Um, and yeah, yeah.

flowartists
And I noticed that you share quite a few cleaning videos and often kind of weird ones like I remember once you like cleaned a rug with snow. I'm wondering like do you have a favorite weird tip or a video that has just been super popular?

Melanie
Um, I think that people really like these soaking videos so where I soak something and show you that it previously looked clean, but it actually really wasn't, and I think people kind of have that like um. Maybe that like little bit of eew factor is there. So um, and then they want to go try it themselves I get so many Dms of people being like I just stripped my pillow cases and I had no idea they were so gross. So that's always really fun.

flowartists
Oh pillows get so gross. It's really disturbing, as I wonder 'did all of that come out of my head?'.

Melanie
Yeah, yeah I actually had somebody recently Dm me and say 'Wow I Just would have thrown them away, like I didn't realize that you could even wash pillows'. So. I Think that sometimes when we share things We think it has to be something giant or revolutionary but we all don't live the same life, so we may have not just encountered that before.

flowartists
And so definitely sharing things like cleaning in your house and just sharing your home in general I think that people feel like they're welcomed into your life which is awesome, because you're building a community and also it's your livelihood to kind of help people with their own homes. But, I Think sometimes with that people lose a sense of proper boundaries when they're talking to someone that they don't know online and I've seen a few of your posts where you've had to really clearly reestablish your own boundaries would you like to share a little bit about how you balance like building a community...

flowartists
That relies on online interaction but also let your self-care and mental health.

Melanie
Sure it's something that I do struggle with and I think that it can be difficult, ah like, we touched on a little bit before I am neurodiverse and I have Adhd and sometimes that heightens my sensitivity and I can be sort of hyperaware of criticism. So that's something I'm definitely still working on but when it gets too much knowing that I can take a break or I can turn off the comments has helped me with that I do. I feel a little bit guilty sometimes about it because I want to build a community and interact with people. But I also know that I'm not the best version of myself when people are making these sort of harmful assumptions about me. Or my life.

flowartists
And I guess as well. It's like that's not who you want in your community. So it's not really worth the effort engaging with that person who only has mean things to say.

Melanie
Yeah, and I think that um, it's hard with sort of these newer platforms I think with Instagram really does allow for community. Um. And people sort of get the feeling that they know you on Instagram with like stories and different ways that you can talk to people through Dms and things like that but like with Tiktok you just show up on a 'for you' page and people find you that way, and that can be a little bit more difficult sometimes because people don't know you they don't know your life. They're just seeing in some instances like a you know fifteen second video and they're making all these assumptions about you and I think sometimes for me that is. Ah, little bit difficult.

flowartists
Yeah I think for everyone as well. It's like having a stranger make these assumptions about you and then tell you about it. It's really like pretty full on.

Melanie
Yeah.

flowartists
And I know that like um Youtube in particular is kind of notorious for having quite a harsh comments on posts and videos.

Melanie
And. Yeah I um I started doing Youtube a while ago and then um had some not great comments and I just decided it wasn't really the outlet for me and turned off those comments. And I think that it's also okay to just say well maybe this isn't for me. Um I don't want people to give up on their dreams or their hopes or their desires just because they are getting this criticism or um, these even just random terrible comments. But...

Melanie
I think that also it sort of takes away from you being an artist and having your um, just sharing what you love does that make sense?

flowartists
Definitely I think there's a lot to be said as well about choosing the platform that's actually going to be useful for what you want to achieve? Yeah I haven't got anywhere near Tiktok.

Melanie
Yeah, we don't have to do it all. Yeah, there's so many many platforms now and I think that you do sort of have to maybe find the one that works for you and makes you feel comfortable as well as gives you the best platform and community.

flowartists
I feel like as well. No matter how much time and energy you have for social media and for creating content, it's going to eat all of it. So even having that boundary like 'oh how much time do I want to spend responding to stuff online today?'

Melanie
Um, yeah, yeah, right? I think that is something a struggle a struggle that creative people have because you could zap all your time. Creating all this content for all these different platforms. But really are you creating? What's important to you, you know and are you creating even what's profitable?
A lot of times you know, you post something and it doesn't lead anywhere. So. I Think we do have to sort of just be constantly evaluating if something is working or not in our lives.

flowartists
Yeah, definitely I think sometimes as well. It can be hard to separate the attention and the response that something might get versus how much money it actually sends to your business because sometimes there's not a correlation.

Melanie
Um, right? Yeah, sometimes it's just a viral video. It's not actually something that is sending business your way.

flowartists
And so to cycle back to interior design like it's often seen as something frivolous, but it can actually be really life changing to create a home space where you can express yourself creatively or to like be your cozy nest to retreat to if the rest of life is hard.

flowartists
Or even to facilitate like a home business or like to downsize and get out of debt or reduce your workload so it can be something decorative but also something really life-changing would you like to speak a little bit about those aspects of creating your space?

Melanie
Sure I know just speaking from personal experience. It's changed my life for sure. At first for me, it was really about the financial aspect of it.
We really felt like we were on a hamster wheel and we were spending all the money that we made we weren't saving anything. So that first year living in the airstream really allowed us to save money and then later to help us buy a small home. And I think as I got deeper into the lifestyle. That's when I realized that it's not just about the finances either, I'm really into the sustainability aspect of it and for me, it's also about having more of a choice in my life. Um, by living in a small space I am able to work for myself and I think that for me personally that's a freedom that is kind of essential and it's helped me to just be a happier person overall.

flowartists
That's awesome. Yeah, and I think it's one of those aspects as well of um, just what I've seen in the yoga teaching world through Covid and through people being more open to online experiences versus in-person experiences whereas perhaps in the past you might have needed an external space to run a business now you can do it from like the corner of a room because you can do it online and.

flowartists
It's kind of opened up all of these possibilities about what you can do with your space and what you can do with your work. So I think it's a really interesting time of shift in the design world and how we design our lives.

Melanie
Yeah I think so too. I think that it's changed our culture in some ways right? and it's also something that we're still learning about and it's okay to need to evaluate that it's okay to need to like even set boundaries around your home like 'I'm only going to go in this room until five o'clock and work', 'from five o'clock you know onward I'm going to set my phones in here after that time'. So I think that it's something too that is exciting. But we also as a culture sort of are going to have to figure out what that means in terms of how we work and how we live.

flowartists
Yeah, definitely absolutely well I guess we've got one more question. It's a question we ask all of our guests and the question is if you could distill everything that you've learned and everything you share down to one core essence.

Melanie
Everything.

flowartists
What what do you think that one thing would be.

Melanie
Let me think for just a second.

Melanie
I think that I would like people to know that and I would have hope for them that they would be able to live a more courageous life and that they would be able to see the things around them and maybe know that they're not working for them and have the courage to make that change if needed. Does that make sense?

flowartists
Beautiful. Thank you so much. Yeah, no, we save the easiest one for last with that question. Ah, and um, yeah I Just want to let you know as well how through pandemic times, um your feed...

Melanie
Um, okay.

flowartists
And a lot of other small space Design feeds have been like a little bit of my self-care and have inspired me to make little changes in my home and...

flowartists
Um, thank you for everything that you put out into the world and all of the energy that you put into creating things for others and everything that you share I really appreciate it.

Melanie
Oh thank you so much. That's really nice to hear.

I hope you enjoyed our conversation with Melanie, and really encourage you to check out her work online - we’ve included all the links in our show notes.

In our next episode we’ll be talking to Bee Mohammed who is the head of patient advocacy at Astrid Dispensary about medical cannabis, how the laws have recently changed here in Australia and some of broader social issues that surround access to plant medicine.

Thank you so much to our patreon supporters - we really appreciate your contributions - they literally help us produce this podcast, and we have now added a new reward to the $34 per month level, which is access to our online library of over 200 yoga, chair yoga, pilates and aerial yoga classes with me and Rane.

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Thanks so much for listening big big love